1979 Ford F150 4X4 brake job - Page 9

75K30 · 04-27-2009, 07:53 PM

why is the driver side wheel cylinder in the bottom of the backing plate?
This entire thing appears to be upside down.
With the cylinder at the bottom the air will stay in the highest point and never bleed.
This being the case, the brakes will always stay spongy and never really work. This might have been the probem in the very beginning.

Did anyone else notice this, or am I seeing something that is not there?

ErwinRommel · 04-27-2009, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 75K30

why is the driver side wheel cylinder in the bottom of the bacing plate?
This entire thing appears to be upside down.
With the cylinder at the bottom the air will stay in the highest point and never bleed.
This being the case, the brakes will always stay spongy and never really work. This might have been the probem in the very beginning.

Did anyone else notice this, or am I seeing something that is not there?

I think I know the problem to that and I don't know if something in the axle is messed up.

I was trying to get the lug nuts off the other days and it turned the whole backing plate upside down while doing taking off the lug nuts in the process.

hotrodpc · 04-27-2009, 08:05 PM

Holy Sheet Batman !!! I did not notice that. I did think it strange the line was down there and the E brake cable on top, but I guess I was thinking it was the angle of the pic. Quite obvious that is not right. You need to fix that Erwin. So are you saying the axle tube had spun in the carrier housing??? I hope you don't mind, but that has got to one of the funniest things I ever saw on a vehicle. Maybe not the funniest but one of them. Just trying to figure out how that happens.

hotrodpc · 04-27-2009, 08:07 PM

How to Bleed Brakes - wikiHow

See if you can make some sense out of this wiki answer. Its step by step, although, I see a couple steps I have never done before.

hotrodpc · 04-27-2009, 08:11 PM

No the axle tube did not spin either, that's impossible. Someone just simply put that backing plate on upside down. You are going to be a pro at drum brakes when you get done. But you are also going to be amazed at how well it stops too and how nice the pedal feels.

75K30 · 04-27-2009, 08:15 PM

This is a 9 inch rear axle, and it is a semi float. While it utilizes a bearing reatainer plate to hold the axle in, it is entirely possible that the 4 bolts that hold the retainer plate together is gone, or at the least something has some severe rust. All in all, this has to be looked at, and addressed. I dont know why the axle did not fall out yet, but this stll has to be addressed.
More pics of the backing plate could not hurt. Take some of the backing plate and axle tube, as well as the retaining plate that is behind the axle flange.

ErwinRommel · 04-27-2009, 08:27 PM

Ok, lol. Thanks guys. I'll get more pics.

ErwinRommel · 04-29-2009, 06:25 PM

UPDATE:
Well me and my brother worked on flipping the backing plate today. Had to loosen the nuts and then beat the backing plate off but in the process the axle shaft popped out a little but we pushed it back in and seen if the drive shaft moved...it did, so maybe it is ok.
Well, I flipped the backing plate around and tighten the bolts back up. The driveshaft and hub was stuck and didn't moved. So I loosen the bolts off and saw that the flange plate was on wrong so I flipped it back around correctly. Tighten the bolts up. The driveshaft still didn't move. The hub was still stuck as well. I looked at the bearing to see if it was stuck. Tried moving it back because the backing plate went back further but the bearing didn't want to. I tried to see if the hub and shaft was still stuck but it wasn't, it moved. So...I don't know if I have to push the bearing back some more or what.

Any ideas?

75K30 · 04-30-2009, 11:59 AM

What is this "hub" that you speal of? The semi floating axle has no "hub". The axle bearing is retained by a small plate with 4 bolts that holds it to the axle. The axle is able to rotate within the bearing.

Now, I have a crazy idea, but need to know what parts are binding. I suspect that the axle bearing is binding and the backing plate could be the problem.
You say that the axle does not turn easilly?
What happens if you loosten the 4 bolts that holds the axle to the housing? It should spin free and easy. Dont worry about removing the axle. There are no magic pieces that will fall out. It pulls right out, and slides right in, so dont be worried about that.

ErwinRommel · 04-30-2009, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 75K30

What is this "hub" that you speal of? The semi floating axle has no "hub". The axle bearing is retained by a small plate with 4 bolts that holds it to the axle. The axle is able to rotate within the bearing.

Now, I have a crazy idea, but need to know what parts are binding. I suspect that the axle bearing is binding and the backing plate could be the problem.
You say that the axle does not turn easilly?
What happens if you loosten the 4 bolts that holds the axle to the housing? It should spin free and easy. Dont worry about removing the axle. There are no magic pieces that will fall out. It pulls right out, and slides right in, so dont be worried about that.

The axle hub, where the bolts are that you use to put on your rim.

I can push the backing plate all the way back but the bearing just doesn't want to go back. I don't know if it does but I think it would go further back like the backing plate.

Here's what we did...
1) Get bit by mosquitoes.
2) B*@&@ and complained that the drum didn't want to pop off right.
3) Got a crow bar and rubber mallet and beat it off finally.
4) Inspected my wonderful work that I did with my brakes
5) Loosen the bolts on the flange plate that holds the bearing and backing plate in place
6) Tried pulling the backing plate off. Didn't work, so we had to beat it off
7) Beat the mess out of the backing plate and it finally popped off, and the axle popped out
8) Held and cussed over/under our breaths. Slide the axle back into place.
9) See if the axle was back in place, and it seem like it was because the driveshaft was moving like it should
10) Flipped the backing plate around and put the flange plate back on and tighten the bolts. The axle didn't want to move. So we loosen the bolts on the flange plate and axle started moving again
11) Fussed with my brother because he thinks that I am an idoit and I don't know ****. Fussed with him and told that he left the flange plate upside down.
12) Turned the flange plate correctly around and tried to get the bearing to go back because we thought the bearing is the problem (my brother thought the bearing is gone). Tried to push it back, went back a little. Put on the flange plate (correctly) and tighten the bolts back up....axle still didn't move.
13) Got tired of fooling with it and having the skeeters biting me and nagging me and left to go home and share what I did that day with yall..

What's yer crazy ideer 750K? Please share. Does it have something with grinding/beating something down?

04-27-2009, 07:53 PM	#81
75K30 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 3,312	why is the driver side wheel cylinder in the bottom of the backing plate? This entire thing appears to be upside down. With the cylinder at the bottom the air will stay in the highest point and never bleed. This being the case, the brakes will always stay spongy and never really work. This might have been the probem in the very beginning. Did anyone else notice this, or am I seeing something that is not there? Last edited by 75K30; 04-27-2009 at 08:12 PM.

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04-27-2009, 08:05 PM	#83
hotrodpc Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: OK Posts: 6,935	Holy Sheet Batman !!! I did not notice that. I did think it strange the line was down there and the E brake cable on top, but I guess I was thinking it was the angle of the pic. Quite obvious that is not right. You need to fix that Erwin. So are you saying the axle tube had spun in the carrier housing??? I hope you don't mind, but that has got to one of the funniest things I ever saw on a vehicle. Maybe not the funniest but one of them. Just trying to figure out how that happens.

04-27-2009, 08:07 PM	#84
hotrodpc Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: OK Posts: 6,935	How to Bleed Brakes - wikiHow See if you can make some sense out of this wiki answer. Its step by step, although, I see a couple steps I have never done before.

04-27-2009, 08:11 PM	#85
hotrodpc Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: OK Posts: 6,935	No the axle tube did not spin either, that's impossible. Someone just simply put that backing plate on upside down. You are going to be a pro at drum brakes when you get done. But you are also going to be amazed at how well it stops too and how nice the pedal feels.

04-27-2009, 08:15 PM	#86
75K30 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 3,312	This is a 9 inch rear axle, and it is a semi float. While it utilizes a bearing reatainer plate to hold the axle in, it is entirely possible that the 4 bolts that hold the retainer plate together is gone, or at the least something has some severe rust. All in all, this has to be looked at, and addressed. I dont know why the axle did not fall out yet, but this stll has to be addressed. More pics of the backing plate could not hurt. Take some of the backing plate and axle tube, as well as the retaining plate that is behind the axle flange.

04-27-2009, 08:27 PM	#87
ErwinRommel Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Southern Georgia Posts: 579	Ok, lol. Thanks guys. I'll get more pics.

04-29-2009, 06:25 PM	#88
ErwinRommel Banned Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Southern Georgia Posts: 579	UPDATE: Well me and my brother worked on flipping the backing plate today. Had to loosen the nuts and then beat the backing plate off but in the process the axle shaft popped out a little but we pushed it back in and seen if the drive shaft moved...it did, so maybe it is ok. Well, I flipped the backing plate around and tighten the bolts back up. The driveshaft and hub was stuck and didn't moved. So I loosen the bolts off and saw that the flange plate was on wrong so I flipped it back around correctly. Tighten the bolts up. The driveshaft still didn't move. The hub was still stuck as well. I looked at the bearing to see if it was stuck. Tried moving it back because the backing plate went back further but the bearing didn't want to. I tried to see if the hub and shaft was still stuck but it wasn't, it moved. So...I don't know if I have to push the bearing back some more or what. Any ideas?

04-30-2009, 11:59 AM	#89
75K30 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 3,312	What is this "hub" that you speal of? The semi floating axle has no "hub". The axle bearing is retained by a small plate with 4 bolts that holds it to the axle. The axle is able to rotate within the bearing. Now, I have a crazy idea, but need to know what parts are binding. I suspect that the axle bearing is binding and the backing plate could be the problem. You say that the axle does not turn easilly? What happens if you loosten the 4 bolts that holds the axle to the housing? It should spin free and easy. Dont worry about removing the axle. There are no magic pieces that will fall out. It pulls right out, and slides right in, so dont be worried about that.